[IP] Re: One of four U.S. jobs headed overseas 1 and comment on

[David Farber <dave@farber.net>]

Begin forwarded message:

From: Bob Frankston <bob37-2@bobf.frankston.com>
Date: June 13, 2007 11:13:18 PM EDT
To: dave@farber.net, ip@v2.listbox.com
Cc: "'Mike Cheponis'" <mac@wireless.com>, "'Dewayne Hendricks'"  
<dewayne@dandin.com>
Subject: RE: [IP] One of four U.S. jobs headed overseas 1 and comment on

Before I criticize this advice I wonder why anyone assumes that sports
(where a Japanese pitcher was big news) or entertainment (films are
increasingly made in Toronto and elsewhere) and investment banking  
(who's
funding our economy anyway) can't be offshored. Lawyering? Well, is  
that a
feature?

I consider this to be very bad advice because it confuses education with
training and shows a disdain for critical thinking and understanding.  
While
one can learn critical thinking abstractly it helps to study hard  
sciences
and learn that being wrong really is a learning experience and not a  
moral
judgment. There's a big difference between selling an idea to a jury and
building something that falls down no matter how much you really  
believe in
your cause.

When was at MIT Harvard Law was trying very hard to recruit people with
engineering background. Alas, the effort seems to have failed since the
legal system continues to view technology as something that gentlemen  
do not
do.

Rather than encouraging people to flee the hard sciences and the related
fields we should require a fundamental understanding of these  
concepts in
order to graduate and be considerate literate. Computers give us a  
language
for dynamic systems and abstractions.

If we are to retain any remaining leadership role we require citizens  
who
have an understanding of the basic concept of science -- knowledge is
tentative and must be tested. You don't prove things by simply citing
examples and you don't assume you will win just because you are  
supposed to
win.

We shouldn't be simply training engineers -- we should be educating  
citizens
with a broad understanding. Engineers should take courses in expressing
ideas and in psychology as well as a course in real accounting (AKA,
information representation) and schools seem to be moving more in that
direction.

Once one is capable of understanding and working with systems once  
can then
venture forth and, if they choose, practice law and maybe even be an
economist.

This advice seems to show the danger of not having a firm background in
critical thinking. Once we've offshored critical thinking what do we  
have
left other than our skill in juggling and amusing those creating lasting
value.


-----Original Message-----
From: David Farber [mailto:dave@farber.net]
Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2007 21:17
To: ip@v2.listbox.com
Subject: [IP] One of four U.S. jobs headed overseas 1 and comment on



Begin forwarded message:

From: dewayne@warpspeed.com (Dewayne Hendricks)
Date: June 13, 2007 5:00:01 AM EDT
To: Dewayne-Net Technology List <xyzzy@warpspeed.com>
Subject: [Dewayne-Net] One of four U.S. jobs headed overseas

[Note:  This item comes from reader Mike Cheponis.  DLH]

From: Mike Cheponis <mac@wireless.com>
Date: June 12, 2007 5:13:46 PM PDT
Subject: One of four U.S. jobs headed overseas

Former Fed official:    One of four U.S. jobs headed overseas

"...an economics professor at Princeton University, told the House
Science and Technology Committee that American jobs in science,
technology and engineering are most vulnerable to offshoring."

<http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/
showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=RFO5U4C3GHTDIQSNDLSCKHA?
articleID=199903533>

----

I've been encouraging smart young folks who have an ounce of ability
to COMPLETELY avoid the SCIENCES, TECHNOLOGY, and ENGINEERING
sectors, as those jobs will be done by very cheap foreign labor.
There is no point in competing with some guy in China who gets paid a
bowl of rice and lives in a tent.

Go into INVESTMENT BANKING, LAWYERING, ENTERTAINMENT, SPORTS,
FINANCIAL SERVICES or something that can't be offshored.

Forget about SCIENCE, ENGINEERING, and TECHNOLOGY - there isn't any
future in those fields.




Begin forwarded message:
From: dewayne@warpspeed.com (Dewayne Hendricks)
Date: June 13, 2007 11:01:17 AM EDT
To: Dewayne-Net Technology List <xyzzy@warpspeed.com>
Subject: [Dewayne-Net] re: One of four U.S. jobs headed overseas

[Note:  This comment comes from reader Ken DiPietro.  DLH]

From: Ken DiPietro <ken.dipietro@advantaq.com>
Date: June 13, 2007 7:16:15 AM PDT
To: Dewayne Hendricks <dewayne@warpspeed.com>
Subject: Re: [Dewayne-Net] One of four U.S. jobs headed overseas

> Mike Cheponis wrote:
> Go into INVESTMENT BANKING, LAWYERING, ENTERTAINMENT, SPORTS,
> FINANCIAL SERVICES or something that can't be offshored.

Mike,

With all due respect, the advice you are handing out is also severely
flawed.

Investment banking? Are you suggesting that someone who is well
educated, has a proven track record of making money and can do proper
marketing cannot become competitive from an overseas location? With
respect to your advice as to entering the legal field, there are several
law firms that hand their research and even their brief writing work to
people located in India (among other places) who have been educated in
some of the finest US legal institutions and are willing to do the work
at their local professional wage level - which, contrary to your
assertion, is not a bowl of rice. I can assure you that this will sooner
rather than later drive the wages in the legal profession down -
assuming we don't do it ourselves given the number of lawyers we are
churning out of our universities.

Add to the above statements, that entertainment is now an industry that
can be delivered anywhere there is an excellent Internet connection
(coincidentally, something that much of the United States is largely
lacking in) Sports - well, certainly our children aren't competing on a
world wide stage on that one (please note the sarcasm, or do you need me
to present Chinese basketball starts as well as Japanese baseball
players who are currently working in the US) and the idea of financial
services being a long term, safe field, I would suggest you should go
have a chat with an accountant that has a clue - perhaps they will share
with you that they also send their work overseas and really only act as
the salesperson for the company. Even medicine, something you might also
think is safe, is being undermined as people travel everywhere from
Mexico and Costa Rica to China for treatment. Heck, I used to live on
the Canadian border and I can state without any uncertainty that
everyone that lived in northern Vermont, that I knew, went to Canada for
everything medical - as the local hospitals were nowhere near as
professional nor were the costs as acceptable.

I am sorry to be so snarky, but I would like to point out that every
single field you mentioned is on the near term list, getting ready for
extinction, as we now know it. We live in interesting times, we need to
learn to deal with it.

Respectfully,

Ken DiPietro - VP/Sales
NextGenCommuncation




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